Sandra's note:
"Wednesday, December 11, we will have a chat on those sorts of still, fallow seasons when it seems nothing is happening. Some people think of it as hibernation, sometimes it seems like cocooning before a burst of energy.
How can we view downtime in ways that we can honor and appreciate it?
Marta Pires joined the chat 2 hours ago
Sandra Dodd joined the chat 2 hours ago
Capn Franko joined the chat 2 hours ago
Capn Franko: Good morning. Or whatever.
Marta Pires: Good whatever here 
Marta Pires: Sandra, I don't know if Jill had a chance to warn you, but she told me that she wouldn't be able to come to the chat today (I believe she's working).
AlexPolikowsky3 joined the chat 116 minutes ago
CatherineWoodward joined the chat 116 minutes ago
AlexPolikowsky3: hello! Thanks for the reminder Marta!! Kids are fed and happy and I am here!
Marta Pires: Yay Alex! :
Sandra Dodd: Thanks, Marta.
Sandra Dodd: I woke up at 7:30 and thought how warm it was in there, and how cold outside (and cold to get to the bigger part of the house—our room is past two unheated rooms).
Sandra Dodd: I fell back asleep until 9:00 and thought of this topic. I was trying it out. 
Sandra Dodd: But I have the huge advantage (EARNED advantage) of having my kids grown and not needing me.
AlexPolikowsky3:
Marta Pires:
Laura joined the chat 111 minutes ago
Laura: Wednesdays are my favorite day of the week because I do not have to leave my house for anything
Jody joined the chat 110 minutes ago
AlexPolikowsky3: I love staying home, specially when it is cold and snowy
Capn Franko: I love being indoors when it's cold, which it is. Fire in teh fireplace and warm lunch.
Capn Franko: MJ had one final this am and is home now before she leavs for her last final this afternoon.
Laura: I just made brownies and grilled cheese. And I think I'll go get a cup of tea
Capn Franko: School.
Sandra Dodd: I put the christmas tree in the den where the fire is. Not at all visible from the road (the tradition of my childhood), but it's in a dark room and so the lights are wonderful.
Sandra Dodd: So I'm between a fire and a Christmas tree. "Limited time offer!"
AlexPolikowsky3: Yep Frank ! Fire in the fireplace!
Capn Franko: Sandra, the way our house is set up , the tree goes best in a place where it's invisible from outside. I, too , grew up having it visible. I like that and wish we could do it easily.
Sandra Dodd: I think Marty has a final too, today.
Robin B. joined the chat 107 minutes ago
Laura: I don't have a fire. I'm not good at building them, but the space heater is nice, ill just use my imagination
Sandra Dodd: He got an A in probability and statistics.
Sandra Dodd: I think. Or history. One of those.
Capn Franko: I put a gaslog in there a few years ago. Easy peasy.
Jody: Hi I'm Jody, I haven't been here in awhile... but have been reading the chats a lot lately.
Capn Franko: Statistics is a difficult PITA. Good for Marty.
Marta Pires: Wow Sandra! Cool! (Marty's A)
Sandra Dodd: Laura, get a little hatchet and buy some cedar wood, so you can split lots of easily-burnable small cedar bits.
Sandra Dodd: Marty figures he will take just two classes at a time forever, since it saves him on his rent.
Sandra Dodd: Kirby just announced on facebook that he and his girlfriend have signed a lease on a duplex.
AlexPolikowsky3: splitting maul~! Easy peasy. I do it. My 11 year old does it even better than me. Oak is easy to split!
Laura: I loved taking classes, I just hated working on degrees
Sandra Dodd: He might end up being a step dad, to a girl named Devin, who's living with her grandmother right now, but the mom/girlfriend won a weird long custody battle, so when they're ready and the little girl wants (she's four or five), then she will go and live with Destiny and Kirby.
Capn Franko: MJ took 20 hours this quater and will repeat that next. Chloe signed up for 25 hours next quarter. Doesn't sound like a fun time to me.
heatherbooth joined the chat 104 minutes ago
AlexPolikowsky3: Laura you come visit I will share my fire-building experienced!
Laura: I have some wood but it doesn't catch fire easily, I'll try the cedar
Capn Franko: Wow! Excitement for Marty. I saw that they're moving in togetgher.
Marta Pires: Great news about Kirby and his girlfriend!
Capn Franko: Marty should have been "Kirby" in my last
Laura: I want to get a wood stove so I guess I will need to learn
Sandra Dodd: I have other fire-started tools and plans, too. Little cedar sticks dipped in melted wax. For the non-artsy starters, toilet paper rolls and paper towel rolls cut with a big paper cutter into rings (inch or so thick, doesn't matter) and dipped in melted wax. But I've collected candle ends forever, years, and I have an old pan with rocks in the bottom to hold an old coffee can in which I melt wax to dip kindling.
Sandra Dodd: I have other fire-started tools and plans, too. Little cedar sticks dipped in melted wax. For the non-artsy starters, toilet paper rolls and paper towel rolls cut with a big paper cutter into rings (inch or so thick, doesn't matter) and dipped in melted wax. But I've collected candle ends forever, years, and I have an old pan with rocks in the bottom to hold an old coffee can in which I melt wax to dip kindling.
Sandra Dodd: his last batch had a bunch of old receipts I dipped. And THAT is how to start a fire.
Sandra Dodd: I also had part of a juniper bush die. I crumbled the dead juniper [not needles, but evergreen dead bits] into a flat cardboard box and poured wax on it. Looks a bit like ugly Rice Krispy Treats, but a chunk of that will start a fire, too.
Sandra Dodd: You could just drip candle wax onto your wood a bit before you light it.
Robin B.: I loved those fire-starter sticks you made for everyone, Sandra, in Santa Fe.
Sandra Dodd: Those are the pretty ones.
Sandra Dodd: We needed hatchets in Santa Fe. There were starter sticks, and wood, but not enough mid-sized kindling.
Laura: So the wax helps? What does the wax do?
Sandra Dodd: Burns, baby, burns.
Sandra Dodd: Makes more mess in the chimney, but a bit, perhaps. Minor.
Sandra Dodd: but a bit meant "a bit" but "but a bit" is fun to say.
Laura: Does beeswax work?
heatherbooth: I've heard that toilet paper rolls stuffed with dryer lint are also good fire starters.
Capn Franko: Dryer lint seems to be good at starting fires in dryer vents.
Sandra Dodd: Sure it would, Laura. Not lots, not gobs. Just some melted on something, so flames can stay long enough to light something else.
Sandra Dodd: Iwould be afraid to have a box of dryer lint too close to a fireplace.
AlexPolikowsky3: dont say burn! Went to flip my roast. Splattered the juices all over me . Burned on my belly and my left eye. It hurts, trying to cope with the pain. Just did it.
Laura: Ouch!
AlexPolikowsky3: clumsy much~!?
Capn Franko: Ouch! Sorry, Alex.
Sandra Dodd: It's not the artsy solution, but I keep a paper bag in the kitchen to collect "burnables." The paper towel that a hot dog was heated up in the microwave in, or the paper bag from microwave popcorn, other used paper towels, especially if grease was wiped up...
Sandra Dodd: but those are too ugly to keep by the fireplace. I use those to start the fire in the hot tub stove.
Capn Franko: My mom hated aprons. (I have no idea why.) So I always eschewed them. Unti one day I used one and discovered just how useful they are. I wear an apron whenever I cook nowadays.
Sandra Dodd: Sorry you burned yourself, Alex. Burned your belly through clothes!? Yikes.
Sandra Dodd: I don't like aprons or gloves. I hope my kids don't pick that aversion up from me.
AlexPolikowsky3: Yep! took shirt off but was too slow to realize
Sandra Dodd: My granny had an apron just for the clothesline. I wish I had one, because the pattern was great! It wrapped around her, and had deep pockets in front that held clothespins.
Sandra Dodd: It had a next strap and bib, and then deep pockets. When she got back from hanging clothes up or taking them down, she hung it right inside the door.
AlexPolikowsky3: I have approns and I like them but I forget to wear.
Sandra Dodd: She made it. I want one.
Capn Franko: I started cooking my bacon in the oven cuz I hate getting spatter burned.
AlexPolikowsky3: I only really wear them while getting dogs ready at dog shows~!
Sandra Dodd: She wore cooking aprons, too, and in those pockets she had kleenex and cough drops.
Sandra Dodd: So we're into our second half hour, and should go to the topic.
Sandra Dodd: I know part of why some people feel guilty or worried if they have a day where "nothing happens."
Sandra Dodd: I bet you know too, lots or all of you.
Laura: My grandmother always had everything anyone could need in her purse
Robin B.: 
Alex.
Alex.
Laura: My mom said we were wasting daylight if we were not up a busy, that's why I feel guilty
Robin B.: When I was a little kid, I wore pinafores.
Robin B.: Sorry, just coming back. No more on pinafores for now!
Capn Franko: I wasn never "living up to my potential.
AlexPolikowsky3: I love days that I can do nothing. When I say I have done nothing that day and I write down what I did it sound like I did a lot!
AlexPolikowsky3: Frank I heard that about me a lot. Even my husband used to say that.
Laura: One of my jobs in high school was to iron clothes, I watched ALOT go old movies with an iron in my hand
Sandra Dodd: Two sins are at play, then.
Sandra Dodd: inactivity is one of the medieval seven deadly sins: Sloth.
Laura: I guess I should have said chores
Jody: My husband likes to always have plans and be doing things, but I love being home. And when it's cold and dark outside a lot (I'm in Canada) it's so cozy and I love it.
Sandra Dodd: And not living up to your potential is wasting the talents God gave you.
Sandra Dodd: Both of them are sins against God.
Capn Franko: Yep.
Capn Franko: The parable of the talents.
Sandra Dodd: The problem with work, work, work just to work, work, work is that people have heart attacks and other health problems.
Laura: I never got that parable, I spent alot of time trying to figure out my talent
Sandra Dodd: People NEED to sleep, and to spend some time with their feet up.
Sandra Dodd: In the parable, it's literal money. A talent was a coin.
Laura: I understand that but as a kid
Sandra Dodd: I don't know where or in which direction the word came into English and whether in other languages that story has the same word for the coin and for a person's abilities.
Capn Franko: The meaning of that one was made *very* clear to me. On a regular basis.
Laura: I spent alot of time trying to figur out my literal talent
AlexPolikowsky3: My husband says his mom called him lazy because he was taking a nap during the day. This man works 365 days a year and very early and then very late. He still feels guilty to rest when he needs.
Sandra Dodd: Maybe if we're all full of voices in our heads from parents, grandparents, sunday school lessons, etc., we can see that for what it is and not pass it on so much.
Sandra Dodd: Did she call him lazy as a kid, though, or as an adult running the farm?
Robin B.: Alex, the old Protestant work ethic.
Sandra Dodd: Marta sees some of my "to do" list because she keeps some of it for me.
Laura: It is hard to get those voices to go away, even to this day I am ashamed when my mom comes to my house
Capn Franko: We tried very consciously to not pass that shit on cuz Ronnie got it, too, and we both knew how much we disliked it.
Sandra Dodd: If I were to focus on that and only decide to nap when it was done, I would never ever take a nap.
Sandra Dodd: EVER.
Robin B.: Ross has some of that. He literally asks permission to goof off (it's a joke, but still).
Sandra Dodd: But when I look at what I HAVE done, and what I still need to do, I feel less guilty about watching a movie or playing a game some.
Marta Pires: But I only see a small part of it and it's already huge.
Marta Pires: I wish you didn't feel guilty at all -- you do so much! We have no idea!!!
Sandra Dodd: Thanks, but it's an internal problem, and an old, deep one.
Laura: My 11 year old hates showers, I struggle with not nagging him!
Robin B.: Marta, you got that right!
Capn Franko: Chloe seems to have inherited/learned this despite our efforts. She's the one who'd come to us with some regularity worry that she "hasn't learned *anything* this week/month/whatever."
Robin B.: Genetics.
Laura: I just mentioned how it might be a good idea again.
Laura: When we are home alot like lately it is worse
Sandra Dodd: Find something to play with.
Marta Pires: By the way, interesting discussion on the Always Learning list about genetics and environment.
Sandra Dodd: Something that swims or bubbles or changes colors or wall paint or ice (for a tub) and finish off with a shower maybe)
Sandra Dodd: Bob is involved in something about reprogramming. I don't remember it if it involves eye movement or hypnosis or what. Couldn't find it on his site anymore when I looked.
Sandra Dodd: But he wrote the best review of my book EVER, so I keep him around.
Sandra Dodd: He's a nice guy and was a nice dad, and those are rare, so it's okay that he's stubbornly wrong about one thing.
Sandra Dodd: Joyce and Schuyler are there to balance it.
Robin B.: Laura, nagging won't help and can hurt your relationship. Make it fun, if you can, like Sandra says.
Marta Pires: Joyce's last post was great.
Marta Pires: The way she tied things in with unschooling.
Marta Pires: Sorry for going a bit off topic...
Laura: I am all the time trying to tell myself that his being a little dirty won't hurt him, but them I worry
Robin B.: My daughter didn't want to take showers at that age, either. Now, she does it just fine on her own. I tried not to worry about it so much if we weren't going out anywhere. But I gave her info on how others might react to her if we were.
Laura: I will let him know when we are going somewhere and ask him to take one and change his clothes b4 we go and he usually does
Laura: He doesn't brush his hair ( which he doesn't like to cut) but I'm ok with that
Sandra Dodd: My boys went through that at that age, too. A time or two I pointed out that I could get in trouble with the county if someone reported them not being clean, so think of a time that would be good to clean up.
Sandra Dodd: If he'll let you wash his hair, that might help with the appearance of cleanliness.
Laura: No he won't let me in the bathroom. I got him one of those soft brushes that makes his hair appear brushed and he will use that sometimes
AlexPolikowsky3: sorry I am back. To answer Sandra. She called him as an adult.
AlexPolikowsky3: When he was younger/
AlexPolikowsky3: That is why I make sure I show appreciation and help him out. It means the world to him
AlexPolikowsky3: My kids don't take many showers. For Thanksgiving I asked my son to take one as he is reaching puberty and had BO and oily hair. He did.
Laura: My dad and MIL died this year, as well as several pets, I think that is behind our extreme hibernation, and I do think it has helped, although
AlexPolikowsky3: He likes his deodorant too.
AlexPolikowsky3: Gigi will do it when I ask and tell her the reason.
AlexPolikowsky3: Take a shower I meant to add
AlexPolikowsky3: I can totally hibernate.
Laura: I don't like to be around people other than ones I'm very comfortable with since then
Laura: My middle son is the same
Robin B.: Ages 10 to 12 (or thereabouts) can be hibernation time for kids, especially boys, it seems.
AlexPolikowsky3: My hibernating gaming 11 year old boy is splitting wood for us right this moment. Elm!!! ( Not as easy as oak!!)
Robin B.: We have a family of hibernators.
Laura: I have a 12 year old and 11 year old and they both rather be home, my two younger kids would rather be out
AlexPolikowsky3: My son too Laura. He will come down and talk only when he likes and knows the person. He is getting a little more outgoing this last month. He was into hiding when we had people over. Now he comes down to talk a bit. He came down when Jihong and Scott were here and that is really a big thing.
Sandra Dodd: I think recovery from trauma is VERY well served by staying home and thinking, just as recovery from an injury.
Sandra Dodd: There are physical rejuvenations that need to be accomplished.
Laura: Yeah, that sound familiar
AlexPolikowsky3: Gigi was one that used to like being out but now she skypes and plays online iwth friends and is OK being home more.
Capn Franko: Chloe
Capn Franko: s typical process was to hibernate for a couple fo days or more then she'd appear and *need* to share/brainstorm what she'd been thinking about.
Sandra Dodd: I think there are definitely seasons of being in and out.
Sandra Dodd: Even for extroverts.
Robin B.: Yup
AlexPolikowsky3: I love being home and I love travelling. I don;t like running errands at all! My husband does so he goes grocery shopping most of the time.
AlexPolikowsky3: Yes Sandra!
AlexPolikowsky3: Kid is still splitting wood out there in very very cold weather.
Sandra Dodd: School told us what our schedules should be, and what we should eat, and when.
Sandra Dodd: School was prescribing matching lives for everybody.
Laura: My husband hates to shop, so I have to, but i don't hate it, just don't love it
Sandra Dodd: But NOT every mean needs to be "balanced." It's okay to eat rice and chicken and a few hours later to have salad. Your body isn't keeping a star chart. It needs a variety of foods but not on a schedule, and not in a certain order.
Sandra Dodd: And your body needs rest.
Sandra Dodd: But it doesn't need rest on a uniform schedule.
AlexPolikowsky3: Laura it maybe because Brian works at home to getting our everyday is fun for him
Robin B.: It can really hard to overcome those eating, sleeping, working schedules. What might be someone's natural rhythm ends up looking like laziness or craziness.
Capn Franko: I'm a "guy." I love to shop for cars, boats, planes, big, expensive toys. I have no interest in "shopping."
Laura: My middle son is happiest when we are all home together, Greg loves to be home too so when he comes home from work, he typically stays home if he can
Sandra Dodd: Keith likes to save money. So he shops at costco for as much as I will let him buy there, and I get the other stuff at Albertson's out behind the house. (Up the alley, behind the house)
(Up the alley, behind the house)
Sandra Dodd: For Keith it's not "shopping fun," it's money-saving activity.
AlexPolikowsky3: Frank my husband likes to shop for cows!
Laura: Greg does like to look at cars
Capn Franko: Chacun a son gout! We all have our preferences. (wink)
Sandra Dodd: He's very methodical about it, and once in a while I go with him and he shows me what's new and let me wander around to see things, but when he's by himself, the list is in order, and he goes through once, skipping aisles he doesn't need, no backtracking, and the things are arranged in orderly fashion in the basket.
Sandra Dodd: When I had kids, sometimes shopping was an outing with one of them (or more) by combining it with something one wanted to do, and then I had company at the store, and then it was interestin. IF I could go slowly and take my time, instead of rushing, it was nice.
Laura: I used to joke that my MIL must have tortured Greg in the grocery store as a child because he has such an aversion to the store
Laura: She always denied it though
Capn Franko: For me, groceries are a gut-level fixation. If I feel like my $$ is constrianed by food cost, I feel NOT abundant. Personal idiosyncrasy.
Laura: I spend alot on food, more than we have to spend on it, but I like good food, so I get depressed about it sometimes
Capn Franko: Yes, Laura. That's me. Feeling constrained about buying food makes me feel "poor." I don't like to feel poor.
Laura: I haven't gotten anything for my kids for Christmas because of that feeling
Laura: Trying to get them things they would like on a budget is so not fun
Sandra Dodd: OH! Do Christmas, and eat rice and beans.
Sandra Dodd: There will be other days to eat well.
Laura joined the chat 47 minutes ago
Sandra Dodd: Quesadillas are cheap where I live.
Marta Pires: Hmmm, quesadillas.....
Sandra Dodd: Refried beans smeared on a tortilla, cheese, another tortilla.
Serah joined the chat 46 minutes ago
Laura: Oh we eat rice and beans and quesadillas, we just like the expensive cheese
Sandra Dodd: Ramen can be good for kids, and a handful of nuts and raisins later.
Serah: my boys LOVE those
Sandra Dodd: Balance it your own way, for your own kids.
Serah: bean and cheese quesadillas
Robin B.: Oh, and Ichiban noodle soups! Good for cold weather! And you can buy 'em by the case for cheap!
Laura: I just don't know what to get them. Have only had one request and that was PS4
AlexPolikowsky3: We spend a lot on some kids of food that I would not chose to buy but they make my husband feels good and happy so I let it go. He never gets anything for himself so if he wants to buy cookies and candy I just don;t say anything,
Laura: Which probably can't be had yet
Sandra Dodd: Sometimes a mom will work really hard at things her kids don't even want or need done.
Serah: what's the topic today?
Sandra Dodd: Hibernating, cocooning, going quiet
Sandra Dodd: not feeling guilty about resting or having down days.
Laura: Or down months
Robin B.: I make notes of things my daughter likes, aside from direct requests. That can sometimes work in my favor for thinking of gifts.
Robin B.: And surprises are nice!
Serah: We need to have our "home days" at least 2-3 a week.
Capn Franko: Being the cook for our family, I understand that. I've spent oodles of time making somethign fancy only to have them choose to cook themselves a pack of ramen. Oh well...
Capn Franko: We all, individually and as a family, absolutely need varying amounts of "down" time.
Laura: Some of my kids most used gifts were things like snugly blankets and warm slippers for those hibernating days
Serah: we have a grocery budget that we try to stick to but sometimes is can be tough
AlexPolikowsky3: My mom used to say to me when I was reading books non stop " Go outside it is a beautiful day!" So I still feel like wasting my time when the day is gorgeous and I don;t go outside and take advantage of it.
AlexPolikowsky3: Thing is I lived in RIO de Janeiro. Days like that were so common. Now here in Minnesota I do want to take advantage of nice warm days.
Serah: I like to hibernate in the winter when it's too cold to go out and then again in the summer on the blistery hot days.
Robin B.: But do you roust the kids out of what they're happy doing to go outside, Alex? Probably not.
heatherbooth: I'm going to go make Austin some food. Chat with you all next week.
Capn Franko: Bye, Heather
Laura: I found when my middle son was little he had to have at least a day or two at home for everyday we did anything( even go to the store)
AlexPolikowsky3: I do not but I have said " It is gorgeous our lets do something" I need to be very careful not to do the same.
Laura: He still does but is better able to talk about it
AlexPolikowsky3: Same here Laura. If we are gone all day one day or two we need to recover !
Laura: When we went into the fall and started our little hibernation this year I mentioned going somewhere and his response was that I said we would stay home and heal
AlexPolikowsky3: My kids and I are just like that. We need to recover and go nowhere .
Laura: So we had a few friends over but didn't go anywhere for a couple months after my dad dies
AlexPolikowsky3: Or go to one place and not many in one day. Having several stops in one day drives us all bonkers!
Laura: It was good for me too
AlexPolikowsky3: Once I am home from one thing we don;t like to leave again until next day..
Capn Franko: I hibernated for a good month after my dad died. Probably a bit longer. Cried randomly when some odd thing would trigger a memory.
Laura: Me neither, I live days where I know I don't have to leave again
AlexPolikowsky3: Sorry about your dad Laura.
Robin B.: It's one thing to invite, another thing to roust!
Sandra Dodd joined the chat 36 minutes ago
AlexPolikowsky3: Gigi has asked me to just do one thing a day and not two activities. One a day she says.
Laura: I think that was part of why it helps, you don't have to feel like you have to fight back feelings cause you are home and comfortable, can let the sadness come on
Sandra Dodd: Life is not homogenized.
Sandra Dodd: There's the humorous phrase "Youth is wasted on the young," but babies are given to young, overwhelmed moms who can't appreciate them.
Sandra Dodd: And naps are given to old people who would really kind of love to have the energy to go and do LOTS of things.
Sandra Dodd: So partly, there are different stages of life represented in all unschooling discussion, and most real-life discussions.
Sandra Dodd: We are, to some extent, looking at different parts of the elephant, as it were.
Laura: I think one of my favorite times of my life was when my oldest was a baby and I stayed home with him
Laura: We did nothing, but eat, nap and change his diaper
Laura: We'd watch the Walton's at noon each day
Sandra Dodd: The Waltons had been cast quickly as a Christmas special, not intended to be a long series.
Laura: One day it wasn't on and I called my husband so upset cause they changed the schedule
Sandra Dodd: And it was disturbing to me how the children were not similar to either parent, and all the accents in the family were different.
Capn Franko: In a similar vein, there's the joke about how you eat an elephant - oine bite at a time. I see so many newbies lately who want to instantly inhale the entire elephant of unschooling at one breath.
Sandra Dodd: "Do a kind of southern accent" is okay for a one-off special...
AlexPolikowsky3: You reminded me Laura how with my son I stayed home and we sat and watched his favorite shows and played a lot together. Sweet times. He did like to go spend hours in the park but only a couple days a week/
Sandra Dodd: Yes, Frank, or assuring us they already have.
Capn Franko: *grin*
Laura: I had my two oldest 15 months apart, so those days when my oldest was a baby were so relaxing as compared to what happened next, I remember them with alot of fondness
AlexPolikowsky3: my babies really did not like car rides so that helped me stay home
Laura: But we had alot of fun when I had 2 as well, just not so much watching of the Walton's, and napping
Sandra Dodd: About days of "nothing happening," my best response to parents who think EVERY day should be remarkable is that they only need 180 remarkable days a year.
Capn Franko: Laura, ours are 18 moths apart. The time with MJ differs greatly from the time after Chloe arrived.
Sandra Dodd: Once their unschooling starts to flow, that's a cinch.
Marta Pires: That response has been really helpful, Sandra, even for a mom that doesn't even have a school-aged child yet.
Capn Franko: When Chloe would come to us wiht her "OMG I haven;t learned anything..." We'd sit and chat about what had been going on over that period and she (and we) could be duly amazed at the amount and intensity of stuff that happened duing that "nothing" period.
Marta Pires: If I look at our week or month, I can see that we did a lot of things.
Laura: My oldest worries he isn't learning
Marta Pires: AND had some down time too.
Sandra Dodd: When parents blog (as Heather Booth and some do) it's easy to look back and see the learning.
AlexPolikowsky3: Right now for my son the most important and remarkable thing is to listen to him and talk to him. Listen to him tell me aobut his games and be interested in them. That is what makes him happy right now. That is his big day when I go and play with him and when I just stop everything and listen to him tell me about it.
Sandra Dodd: Seeing the cultural conditioning for what it is helped me.
Sandra Dodd: Realizing it was Baptist pressure to WORK for the church, WORK in the community, WORK at home.
Laura: I guess I've noticed as they get older and more independent I have less knowledge of what they are doing
Sandra Dodd: And then at school, the competition.
Laura: Less understanding
Sandra Dodd: I learn about Kirby and Marty largely from Facebook.
Sandra Dodd: When Holly was on her epic road trip (6000 miles, alone) I saw comments on the host-moms' facebooks, and sometimes a tweet from Holly.
Laura: They cycle through things, lately James plays lots of soccer on the Xbox and on roblox
Laura: Actually it is football on roblox
Sandra Dodd: So try to appreciate the "not knowing" that startss happening as they get older at home.
Laura: He is all into football, has never played but wants to play next fall ( at 13)
Capn Franko: Chloe was 11-12 when she went to Summerhill and we barely heard from her. It did require some internal adjustment on our part.
Sandra Dodd: Doesn't sound very lazy.
Sandra Dodd: She was still young. I don't mind getting used to it.
Sandra Dodd: I knew Kirby and Destiny were going to go house hunting with a realtor last Friday, and before Friday I mentioned it to Keith and then hadn't thought of it again until now.
Sandra Dodd: Until I saw the note.
Sandra Dodd: I've thought about hurring up about wrapping their gifts and getting them in the mail, and thought LOTS about baby Kirby as I was putting up Christmas decorations.
Sandra Dodd: I can go days without thinking of Marty in his current form
Capn Franko: Yep, it's been more gradual since then. But starting this Summer we expect/hope to leave them in the house going to college while Ronnie and I hit the road. Then our commnication will be more sporadic.
Sandra Dodd: It's almost (for me, anyway) as though the ghosts and memories of the younger are mine, in my house, and the present reality is some other thing, elsewhere.
Sandra Dodd: That's fine with me.
Sandra Dodd: Sometimes all the older kids need is some money or to know where the tools are.
Capn Franko: Yep. Or the recipe for a favorite dish. Or the trick to repairing a faucet. Stuff like that.
Sandra Dodd: What have we not discussed yet that we chould? Anyone here need ideas or reassurance about the value of being still for a while, or staying home for a while?
Sandra Dodd: Anyone need absolution for guile?
Sandra Dodd: GUILT
Sandra Dodd: ?
Sandra Dodd: I can't absolve you for guile., you sneaky things.
Capn Franko: *I* need that stuff. The kids, not so much. Happily.
Sandra Dodd: Cool, innit
Sandra Dodd: That our kids can have advantages in super-useful but invisible, insubstantial ways
Sandra Dodd: People want to see unschooling "success" in terms of college or jobs or money.
Capn Franko: Yeah! I'm so delighted that they aren't me.
Sandra Dodd: But there are things that will serve them well for life that will be hard to show and hard to prove.
Capn Franko: Those are the best things weve given them.
Sandra Dodd: I can't say our kids grew up undamaged, as was Keith's stated goal. But I know there are certain damages Keith and I took that the kids never knew.
Marta Pires: I'm glad I was already reading a lot about radical unschooling when Constança went through a phase when she just wanted to stay home. The pressure was big, from my family, and she was only 2 or 3!
Capn Franko: Precisely true for us.
Marta Pires: She likes to stay at home, but she goes out and likes it too.
Sandra Dodd: The internet gives people the ability to socialize and to help the world without leaving home, too.
Sandra Dodd: People used to have to get out to serve others (or knit socks or make quilts—people DID find cottage-industry ways to be helpful to the poor or to soldiers and such).
Laura: I do think knowing about unschooling shaped the way I have dealt with my middle sons need to be home
Sandra Dodd: But now, there are countless ways to BE, to be helpful and connected from home.
Laura: I haven't done everything right but I have been a
Laura: Alot more accepting Than I would have been
Capn Franko: I think "scree time" in its various forms is one of the best resources we have. I', befuddled by the chrun I see around it from Waldorfians et al.
Capn Franko: chrun = churn
Marta Pires: "Eyeball time", Frank.
AlexPolikowsky3: I used to worry but now I don;t .( about staying home) Why? because I am looking at my son and seeing him happy right now. I also do more to connect with him and listen to him and play with him. I had not done much because he is a kid that just goes and does his thing, Once I started to be more proactive , again, about playing with him a little everyday , I can see he is happier .
Marta Pires:
Capn Franko: I use my eleballs out in nature, too. Still confused by that purity of their ideology. But not really cuz I know that it is "religious" with Adler's adherents.
Laura: He doesn't really Skype much with friends either, although he does some, but he knows what he needs and gets sad we we don't accept it
Sandra Dodd: And every single crime committed out on the street would not have happened if the perp had been at home.
Sandra Dodd: Perhaps staying home will become a virtue!
Laura: The day of Halloween for ex, he decided he didn't want to go do the things we do every year
Sandra Dodd: It's partly religiousish and partly economic/mercenary. They have things to sell. Their school environment with its controls, and their STUFF.
AlexPolikowsky3: I am surrounded by homeschoolers who are very anti TV and "screen time". UGH! So locally we have very little friends.
Laura: The other kids went with my husband and after about a half an hour ( I wish I hadn't taken that long) of him feeling bad, I suggested we fgo out to eat. The night was a success
Sandra Dodd: Silk scarves and recorders are nice, but they aren't going to play themselves, and no kid will play with silk scarves for hours on end unless it's juggling, maybe, or dancing with them.
AlexPolikowsky3: Laura sounds just like my son. He does not socialize online either ( While Gigi does tons). He also did not go trick or treating on Halloween. He said he was done. So we just smiled and let him be.
Sandra Dodd: Who was home to give out candy?
Laura: We don't get trick or treaters
Jody: skype has been fabulous for us, having just moved halfway across the country. My kids talk more with their friends now than when we lived a drive away from them. But many of the homeschoolers here seem to be very against "screen time". I think we too will have few local friends!
Robin B.: ~ he knows what he needs and gets sad we we don't accept it ~ I'm confused Laura. What did you mean?
Laura: To big a hill, lazy kids these days
AlexPolikowsky3: We don;t either being our in the country!
Sandra Dodd: And your house not right up to the road, either, Alex.
Capn Franko: We went through two huge bowls of candy, being urban folksd. I stayed here to give it out whil eROnnie and the girls went out and about.
Laura: I mean, he knows when he can handle being around people, but sometimes I push him to try anyway, makes him sad cause I am accepting him for who he is
AlexPolikowsky3: yep!
AlexPolikowsky3: I love giving out candy! Used to when I lived in North Carolina. So much fun!
Sandra Dodd: Because you are *not* accepting him, you mean, Laura?
Laura: I meant not accepting
Capn Franko: Esecially as a wacky unschooler when I hold out the bvowl and say, "Take some." instead of gingin them one stingy piece. Some kids stand stunned for quite a while before tentatively reaching in to grab a favorite type of candy.
AlexPolikowsky3: Laura My husband and I finally stopped any pressure (even if we thought we were not pressuring there was some) and just accepted. My son is so much happier now. Big time happier.
Sandra Dodd: I think being at peace and still at home should be considered MORE positive than sleep. People were talking about being "a good sleeper," but the same people might not be as nice if the kid sits on the couch for a few hours straight.
Laura: Yes, I've gotten better about that but sometimes I lapse, especially when I am thinking about masked and want to get out
Sandra Dodd: "Masked"?
Robin B.: Sometimes pressure can be in a look or a sigh. My daughter reads body language and attitude *really* well.
Laura: Sorry, my spell check, thinking about myself
Sandra Dodd: Ah, yes.
Laura: I'm trying to type in an iPad
Sandra Dodd: Finding ways to get out is good.
AlexPolikowsky3: Some here Robin. They can feel it.
Sandra Dodd: I love my ipad, but I don't write with it.
AlexPolikowsky3: It is easier for me to get out because Brian is home working so I can leave my son home a lot more.
Laura: Yes, he is Very in tune to my feelings.
Sandra Dodd: I have a bluetooth keyboard, but still... it's for finger-poking purposes, the ipad
Sandra Dodd: Ands someday both kids will let you leave for a month or more. Someday.
Robin B.: I'm on my bluetooth keyboard with my iPad now. I like it. I used to avoid it.
Robin B.: I'm working on my laptop at the same time.
Sandra Dodd: Thanks for being here, all of you.
Sandra Dodd: I hope you'll be better able to chill, relax, hang out.
Marta Pires:
AlexPolikowsky3: Brian has also changed and is way more mellow about it putting no pressure and being more interested in our son's gaming. I think it was after Jill and Sandra were here that he relaxed more. My son's response to it has been greatl/A couple lapses in the Summer but we recovered quick and things are sweet.
Sandra Dodd: I hope I haven't gotten so relaxed from all this talk that I don't bother to mail Kirby's Christmas stuff. Maybe tomorrow...
Capn Franko: LAter, y'all.
Marta Pires: Cool Alex!
Sandra Dodd: Nice to hear, Alex.
Serah: thanks for the chat everyone. Happy hibernating
Sandra Dodd: Happy wintery warmness!!!
Laura: Bye bye
Robin B. left the chat 106 seconds ago
AlexPolikowsky3: Stay warm !!!!!!!! Going to play games with my son. He is waiting!!!!!!!
Going to play games with my son. He is waiting!!!!!!!
Marta Pires: Sandra
Sandra Dodd: yes?
CatherineWoodward: Thanks for the chat, bye!
Marta Pires: Regarding previous chats, I'm going to copy and paste all of them to the blog, even if they're still unedited.
Marta Pires: I was thinking that if something happens to me or my computer, you'll lose them.
Sandra Dodd: Okay
Marta Pires: So I'll put them there.
Sandra Dodd: Thanks.
Marta Pires:
Serah left the chat 27 seconds ago
Sandra Dodd: Bye, Catherine!
Marta Pires: You're welcome!
CatherineWoodward left the chat 21 seconds ago
Marta Pires: Bye
